RAB is on vacation for awhile, so I would ask for a group effort with News Roundup. Feel free to post links and a short summary or money quote in the comments.
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/07/29/nyregion/promised-better-life-by-beauty-schools-graduates-have-little-training-and-lasting-debt.html?hp
This article about beauty schools using non-dischargeable federal loans to rip off poor people with dreams of a lower-middle class job is alarmingly similar to the current state of the law school scam.
RAB - we miss you!
Normally my eyes glaze over at employment statistics but this set is a little disturbing, or it would be if you believed in a future for this country.
ReplyDeletehttp://www.gallup.com/poll/163727/fewer-young-adults-holding-full-time-jobs-2013.aspx
"Even fewer twenty-somethings have full-time jobs than last year", 47% in 2012, and 43.6% in 2013.
Jeez, those numbers are like bombed-by-austerity countries like Greece or Spain. At least the young Spaniards don't have big student loans to pay back and get a (small) unemployment payment.
What kind of country will this be in 10 or 20 years when huge segments of the population sat at their parents homes playing Guitar Hero instead of learning a profession?
maybe we should let in a few million more unskilled illegal immigrants for these people to compete against for entry level jobs
DeleteWe need more free trade agreements and "competition" in the "markets." The dimwitted folks at The Economist and the CFR will tell you about all the glories of liberalism.
DeleteIf these statistics are surprising to you, then you are blessed. Since graduating from law school 3 years ago, I haven't had a full-time job (despite applying to over 750 jobs) and consider myself blessed just to have a part-time job. Many of my cohorts are in the same position.
DeleteNo paid days off, no vacation, and of course, no health insurance. It's a new world out there, and at this point, I just consider myself lucky to be employed. Anything beyond that is pretty rare, and I can't remember what it's like to actually get a paid holiday. I'm a little surprised that what is reality for so many can be surprising to a few.
Thanks, guys! Back in a few days!
ReplyDeleteI've read similar stuff about culinary schools. Many charge 40-60k tuition and their grads end up as food prep workers or short order cooks for minimum wage. With all the cookbooks and videos and web sites and tv shows about cooking do you really need to pay tens of thousands of dollars to learn to cook??
ReplyDeleteHeeeeelp! There's a huuuuuge rotten "Seton Hall Law sticking out of the toilet!"
ReplyDeleteAccording to the National Law Journal, the NLJ 350 (the 350 largest firms in the US) added:
ReplyDelete"just 622 associates in 2012. About 45,000 students graduate from law schools each year."
If this is correct (and even I find it hard to believe), it means the 350 largest firms in the US each hired a grand total of 1-2 associates.
Is there any way of checking this? Because if it is correct, then it needs to be far more widely known.
Link:
http://www.law.com/jsp/nlj/PubArticleNLJ.jsp?id=1202602658651
What this must mean is that these firms grew by an average of a little less than two associates in 2012. Per NALP data they hired a little more than 5000 new grads, which means they booted around 4500 of their former associates to make room for the new arrivals.
DeleteWelcome.
DeleteProfessor Campos - thanks for your explanation.
DeleteIt would be interesting to learn what the 'survival rate' is in BigLaw. How many associates are employed after 3, 4, 5 etc years and still have a chance of repaying their non-dischargable loans? My guess is that by the 6th year fewer than 10% are still around.
1:27 PM
The $64,000 question is how these big law alumni fare long term in the job market. My class saw more and more people out of work as they racked up experience. It is incredible. People with years in big law now solo or in situations where they are unlikely to earn a living. People who survived often had the luck to be in a good practice area in a good firm for that area or are in demand in house because their area is in demand.
DeleteI see ads for all kinds of worthless (but expensive) degrees on TV these days. And they always remind you that "financial aid is available to those who qualify."
ReplyDeleteWhen they say "financial aid," they really mean, "Politicians have decided that the taxpayers will guarantee huge, unsecured loans for you to attend our school (which probably won't help you contribute to society)."
Until we turn off the fire hose of taxpayer-guaranteed student loans, this awful mess will continue. The current educational model has been completely corrupted by easy student loans.
As someone else said recently, if these schools were a good investment, they could just set up their own financing companies to help you pay (like auto and appliance manufacturers do). But they don't, because they know half of their students are going to be financially ruined by their "educations."
The availability of supersized student loans is the oxygen feeding the fire that burns today's students.
DeleteSounds like it's high time to cap loans at a maximum amount that is far lower than it is presently, and then have several repayment options based on ability to repay... and include a final, last resort option of discharge.
Law school reminds me of payday loans ... but the lenders in that situation actually lend money against a far more solid certainty --namely, the next paycheck. Law school simply relies on the fact that "everyone knows lawyers are going to make a whole lotta money."