Tuesday, September 5, 2017

Toilets Я Us: The InfiLaw chain of scam-schools

As long-standing readers of Outside the Law School Scam will know, the privately owned "InfiLaw System" operates law schools for profit. InfiLaw claims that its "schools have a demonstrated ability to achieve superior outcomes that are a function of admission processes (which probe beyond traditional quality indicators and factor otherwise overlooked predictors of success) and programmatic innovation, academic support processes, and faculty focus on student success". Let's evaluate this "demonstrated ability".

InfiLaw's three schools are (or were) the following:

Charlotte School of Law: Defunct since August 2017, when the state yanked its license. The LSAT scores of the last entering class were 141, 144, and 148 (at the 25th, 50th, and 75th percentiles, respectively). In November 2016, the ABA put Charlotte on probation for failure to meet even the ABA's dreadfully low standards of admission. One student "there was no application process" and that the school would call "two and three times a day" to badger prospective students with "aggressive predatory sales tactics". A federal criminal investigation of Charlotte has been under way for more than a year. Forty percent of last year's graduates are unemployed, and only one-third of last year's graduates have long-term, full-time jobs.

Arizona Summit Law School: On probation since March 2017 for falling short of the ABA's abysmally low academic and admissions standards. LSAT scores: 140, 143, 148. More than 20% of last year's graduates were unemployed, and more than a third of that class did not find long-term, full-time work. Only a quarter of first-time candidates passed the Arizona bar exam in July 2016.

Florida Coastal School of Law: At risk of losing eligibility for federally guaranteed student loans. LSAT scores: 141, 144, 149. Only a third of those taking the bar exam last year passed. Forty percent of last year's graduates are unemployed, and less than half of that class found long-term, full-time jobs. Not a single graduate got a federal clerkship or a job in Big Law.

InfiLaw also made an unsuccessful bid to buy the for-profit Charleston School of Law (LSAT scores 141, 145, 149), the only other school that currently fails the "gainful employment" standard of eligibility for student loans.

Where have the InfiLaw schools "achieve[d] superior outcomes"? Not in the department of employment for their graduates. The unemployment rates listed above are reminiscent of the Great Depression. And even the most happily employed InfiLaw graduates can hardly be called smashing successes, concentrated as they overwhelmingly are in tiny firms, "government", and "business". Of the many adjectives with which one might describe those outcomes, inferior would be an understatement; superior, a whopping lie.

How about "admission processes"? The disaffected student reported above suggests that her toilet had no meaningful admissions process, just an aggressive telemarketing campaign. How exactly does an InfiLaw toilet, with "no application process", ferret out "otherwise overlooked predictors of success"?

In the running of scam schools, however, InfiLaw has "demonstrated ability" in spades. All three InfiLaw toilets rank in the top third by cost of attendance. Until recently, they ranked among the top few in enrollment, with four-figure student bodies: as recently as 2012, Charlotte alone enrolled 626 first-year students. Roughly a third of InfiLaw's students pay full fare, and only 2% or so get free tuition. While it lasts, therefore, InfiLaw milks about a hundred million dollars per year out of the public—thanks largely to the arbitrage scheme known as federally guaranteed student loans. Small wonder that InfiLaw "probe[s] beyond traditional quality indicators" to take in just about anyone who can arrange payment of InfiLaw's obscene fees.


  1. " concentrated as they overwhelmingly are in tiny firms, "government", and "business". Of the many adjectives with which one might describe those outcomes, inferior would be an understatement; superior, a whopping lie. the many adjectives with which one might describe those outcomes"

    You know what your problem is Old Guy... you are an elitist. You are convinced that because you went to an "elite" law school, that makes you better and smarter than everybody else, and that those who do not work in big law or as Clerks for Federal Judges are "inferior". And you can't get over the fact you have not been able to parlay your judicial clerk experience into one of those elite jobs. As if you were somehow deserving simply because of where you went to school. That's not how it works in real life.

    It doesn't matter to you elitists that many of those who are working in "tiny firms" are knocking it dead...or perhaps you were not even aware of that fact. The real lawyers in the country are those who work in large and small firms all over the country, who represent their clients well inside and out of court. They are the ones who are the real lawyers... not elites who think working as a cog in a huge firm is worth more than a pitcher of warm spit...after five years of working with other elites perhaps they will realize how worthless their educations.

    Atticus Finch was a small time lawyer Old Guy... went, I am sure, to the local Regional Law School... didn't go to Harvard where the financial criminals of the country are trained, where soulless lawyers are created.

    And you know... Cognitive Dissonance is a terrible thing...perhaps your issue is not your age nearly as much as your attitude. But of course, that is not something you could ever accept is it?

    I'm not going to defend the Infilaw Schools...they are obviously scams...but I am tired of you and yours panning all but the very top ten schools as if the top lawyers actually come from those schools. Bullshit...nothing special about those guys other than, in their own eyes, they are special snowflakes.

    The lawyers of my day graduating from the good law schools instead of the top law schools are the ones who are the champions of Justice. Are the ones who ensure the Rule of Law in the country. They don't sit around moaning about how terrible life is. Even if they aren't making six figure incomes, they are still doing better than most Americans financially and they are doing jobs they can often feel good about.

    Not everybody who graduates from a non-tier one lawschool is a loser.. not all of us always feel sorry for ourselves. We are too busy being the leaders of our communities.

    1. Atticus Finch was also a fictional character, just like many of the so-called outcomes law schools touted for their graduates. Reality has a way of catching up.

      Look, your point is taken that there are "good" lawyers out there, from "respectable" schools. What this blog and others are ultimately talking about is playing the odds over the last twenty years or so. If you are throwing down $200k for a law degree, then the better the school, the better the outcome and chance of servicing that debt. Or at least, that is how it was supposed to be, but even that assumption is more and more in question. That may be elitist, but it is also the truth.

      Back in the 70s, when there were fewer lawyers at a much-reduced cost of tuition in adjusted dollars, you could have a go at it and regional schools provided "good" results for graduates. Those days may return again as the market shakes out. Currently, that risk is too high for too many, given the overproduction of lawyers and the insane price it takes to get there.

    2. I stand by what I said: the outcomes for the graduates of InfiLaw toilets are anything but superior. Forty percent unemployment and sixty percent marginal employment add up to one hundred percent shit, especially with a six-figure price tag.

      No, I don't want to work for a big firm. I never did. And when I refer to my law school as "élite", I refer to its aristocratic character, not to its quality. I consider it a first-tier toilet.

      Very few fresh graduates going into small law firms make salaries high enough to justify a degree that costs a quarter of a million dollars or more. Many of those people allegedly working for small firms aren't getting a salary at all: they are self-employed or receive a percentage of hours billed (and possibly collected). With rare exceptions, those on salary do not make nearly enough to support the payments on a couple of hundred thousand dollars' worth of student loans. And the graduating classes of toilet law schools feature precious few of those exceptional lawyers, and still fewer "leaders of our communities".

      "The lawyers of [your] day" were and are far better placed than those of my day. Time was when just about any degree in law would lead to good professional opportunities. Today, however, even a degree from Harvard or Yale is likely to turn out poorly, never mind one from some undistinguished law school.

      As for Atticus Finch, he was a fictional character from a hundred years ago who probably didn't go to law school at all, and he was also poor. (For that matter, Harper Lee dropped out of law school even though her father was a high-placed lawyer.) Some of us cannot afford to receive payment in sacks of hickory nuts.

    3. The law is an elitist profession. It's an aristocracy profession. So is medicine.

      If you come from money, you'll do well in America - never mind what you choose to do with your life. The pull of money alone will stack the odds in your favor. Think of a magnet and how it has two poles. However, the same principle works in reverse: If you don't come from money, the odds are very great that you will never experience much success regardless of what you do or how intelligent you are.

      Just saw the usual "Get a Fed. Gov't Job" tripe at the usual and customary message board for disgruntled JD's.

      Jesus Christ.. Enough already. They may as well sticky the thread so every time someone has something to say on that topic all the garbage can at least go in one place. That topic has been bouncing around on that forum for 15 years.. Same old. Same old.

      Listen kiddies.. There aren't enough gov't cheese jobs to go around and, I'm sorry to tell you, not everyone can get a gov't job. Not gonna happen..

      Aside from that, they'll all on about this GS-12 shit, etc. The majority of these so-called "excellent" jobs are in DC and the surrounding environs. Good goddamned luck.. 60-80K down there AND loans?? You may as well be working for nothing - because that's what the effective result will be. COL down there will eat that up quickly and FORGET even thinking of buying a home. 1963 shitboxes sell for over the 1/2 million mark.

      As for PSLF.. That will be gone soon. No advantage to a Fed/State/Local job very soon.

      People that come from non-elite schools - and that's the great majority - have already lost the Game. Because that's how America works. It's all about money, class, and connections.

      Old Guy may be an elitist but at least he's not trying to lie or sugarcoat. Anyone who gambles today on $250,000+ between college and law school is a fool. The wealthy kids have Mom and Dad paying and are already in the better schools and headed for the better jobs, period.

      Everyone else is buying a $300k Lottery Ticket and doping up on hope - along with a goodly dose of plebeian stupidity and belief and misunderstanding of the System.

    4. I respectfully disagree with 6:35 above that medicine is an elitist or aristocratic profession. Medicine is far more of a merit based profession. I graduated from a toilet law school before the great recession with good grades and law review. I participated in OCI and interviewed for big law and Fed govt jobs. I did not receive a single call back interview. I continued to apply for every job opening throughout law school and after graduation. I was rejected by big law, governments, states attorneys offices, public defender offices, and small law. I never received a single job offer. The legal market was supposedly booming, at least that’s what law schools were claiming. The schools claimed everyone was getting six figure jobs.

      I returned to undergrad to take the science prereqs for med school. I took the MCAT. I applied to med schools and received interviews at some of the top med schools. I ended up attending a highly ranked school (the unranked med school at the toilet where I attended law school refused to give me an interview). I have absolutely no connections. I was the first to attend college from a low middle class family. Without the scam blogs, I had no idea that law schools were lying about employment to scam students out of student loan money. The lack of information set me back years. Those years could have been spent practicing medicine. Or I could have used that time to pursue a PhD or an MPH.

      My classmates were from the Ivy League or the other elite schools outside the Ivy League. They were all very kind. I think because medicine is about helping people, the profession attracts less competitive people. Unlike law school where Harvard grads taught classes and played hide the ball, the med school professors actually cared about teaching. Most of the professors that taught the first year classes were PhDs. During the second year, the courses were taught by experienced, practicing MDs. The third and fourth year was spent in the hospital or in the clinics seeing patients under the supervision of MDs. Since the classes were pass fail, and medicine in general is a profession about serving others, we had a cooperative environment. The med school professors just wanted everyone to pass. And the students worked together. We even had classes taught by nurses. Medicine is about all health professionals working together, whether they be doctors, PAs, nurses, or pharmacists. Nobody judges another medical professional based on where they went to school.

    5. Yes, I know. You've posted your story on the forum I mentioned above several times.

      Medicine is an elitist profession and is not about helping people. It's about money, just like law. Most doctors come from money, the very upper echelons of the income brackets in fact. Very few come from middle class, modest, or poor backgrounds.


      5.5% come from the lowest quintile.

      There are exceptions. But that doesn't make them the Rule.

      Doctors killed student loan bankruptcy discharge - and they're going to kill it again:


      They are even calling PSLF "The Doctors' Loophole":




      In the first link, no one except connected Rich Kids could slum at Legal Aid for 10 years and then move to Biglaw. I've never heard of this happening.

      The second scenario with doctors is likely exactly what most will do and are doing now.

      So, in the end Congress will justify eliminating PSLF because highly-paid, greedy doctors abused the System. Because no one thought of this beforehand and so they could.

      That's *exactly* how the System works. The Takers take more and don't worry about it. The rest lose. The practical effect will be that many doctors will have massive amounts of student debt forgiven, making low salaries during their internships and residencies and then mid-to-high six-figure salaries thereafter while a few lawyers manage to have their loans discharged through PSLF and continue to make 40-50k - if that - throughout the rest of their lives.

      Congress nonetheless will look at this as justification for ending the program and will do so. And that will happen soon.

      I suggest reading this book:


      A relative of mine was almost killed by the incompetence of Mr. Elite Yale MD. He never spent the 5 minutes needed to read her file to understand that the medication he prescribed was contraindicated. Luckily, the lowly pharmacist serving that relative for 10+ years and who had all her records on file caught it. Otherwise, they would've died from a medicine-induced heart attack.

      I have even less respect for the Shamen in White Coats than I do for the Lords in Black Robes.

      Lastly, if not for insurance all most people would, or could, afford to pay would likely be sacks of grain, some chickens, or possibly firewood.

      Doctors living is insurance. Lawyers literally have nothing but clients since most are solos (+40%).

      Congress, as I said above, will however eliminate PSLF based on the abuses of people who take the most from the System leaving the rest to fend for themselves.

      Helping people?

      Doubt it.. I doubt it very, very much.. Helping themselves at everyone else's expense? Yup!

    6. I believe there is a lot of merit in the words of 7:39. Many doctors are all about money...not all of course, but many. That is why I rarely trust their advice without doing my own research. Their advice is often based on what makes them the most money... sad but true.

  2. Remember how they did a refinancing a few years ago? They borrowed against profits to pay a special tax-free dividend to the original investors. That means the lenders will now lose money when the schools wither up and blow away. The real scamsters are presently laughing in Aspen, Kauai, La Jolla, or wherever.

  3. Serious question: Do any of the scammers at InfiLaw feel even the slightest twinge of conscience over what they are doing? Do they ever experience even a fleeting sense of guilt about the lives that they are ruining? How do these morally bankrupt people justify/rationalize/excuse the evil that they are committing?

  4. Running a scam school is the only area where these "educates" care to excel.